new Canon G10 and WP-DC28
canon announced the G10 (top of the line compact) as well as a matching underwater housing WP-DC28. (photos are from the canon website)
about the G10:
- 28mm wide lens with 5x zoom,
- i-constrast, which is something that claims to boost brightness in order to retain detail in the shadows. sounds great.
- one more dial, for exposure compensation
- raw,
- 1/1.7" CCD sensor with loads of megapixels.
the WP-DC28 housing looks a lot like the WP-DC11 for the G7 (and the one for G9) with a large oval shaped lens barrel which made it impossible to use wide angle wet lenses for the previous models. i guess the same will be true for the G10.
any hope ikelite will choose to make one of their new "compact" housings for this camera? that would be great.
Posts
38 comments:
Sorry to have to ask, but what is the advantage of wider lenses for underwater work? I know the effective angle is smaller in water, but by how much? The 28 mm angle of the G10 seems good, but I guess not enough...
Also, is there any solution out there for P&S cameras that allows for a dome port fitting? It would be so great to use these cameras for half-under shots.
Thanks!
Yves
the weird size/shape lens barrel also makes it a problem to attach macro lenses and red filters. i use my G7 with filters and an inon macro wet lens and i get problems in the corners as the lenses slightly obstruct the lens view in the wide side.
and also wide angle mainly helps you get closer to minimize the amount of water between the camera and your subject, and allows you to get better light from your strobes on your subject.
if i remember correctly, things appear 25% closer underwater, which is a 33% magnification (times 4/3)
as for the over-under shots, have you seen the fisheye or dome port wet lenses from inon?
here are a couple of links
http://www.camerasunderwater.co.uk/general/lenses/inon_m67.html
http://www.reefphoto.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=96&products_id=32
but, you see, again with the weird canon g10 lens barrel you cannot use these lenses, because they block the view.
for the G7 there was a solution with the ikelite housing , with a shorter lens port, that actually blocked the lens from zooming all the way out, but allowed wet wide lenses.
Hi Taso,
I am new with this kind of Camera. Never have one before as previously i used only Nikonos V.
I have just bough G10 and need a housing for it. Do you mean that if we use G10 with WP DC28, we can not utilize the fuction for macro? Or we can not add wet lenses and red filter using WPDC28?
Thanks Mei (I don't have google/blogger account)
hi mei,
my comment was about mounting wet lenses and only about wide angle ones.
the camera macro mode works excellent with my G7 in the equivalent canon housing (WPDC11).
i am also using an M67 adapter to mount red filters and wet macro lenses. my inon UCL-165 macro lens slightly gets in the way at the corners but you can just zoom in a bit and it works great.
here is the adaptor you could use on the G7/9 dont really know if it fits your G10:
http://uwdigitalcamera.com/goods_detail.php?goodsIdx=264
did you get any photos yet with your g10? must be a great camera.
I was looking for a UW housing for the G10 and I arrived to your page. I have no experience in UW photo but some experience in wildlife photo (see my blog). I did some diving years ago and maybe I'll be back, but what I want to do now is to photograph river animals in their habitat, eg, snakes, frogs, dragonfly larvae and such. This can be done at less than 1m below the water, with no diving equipment (I hope).
I would need macro, no shutter lag and a out-of-camera flash.
Is the G10 a good choice?
What are "wet" lenses?
What kind of flash should I use?
Thanks for your help !
Hi Frikosal:
Seems like no one answered you yet. Please do not take my words for granted as I'm sure there are lot of expert UW photographers here.
I am using Oly sp350 now but was looking into the canon G10 to upgrade, but at this point i really dont know yet...
As far as I know the main problem with the G series is the lens barrels extends too far and as a result if you add an wideangle attachment lens (attaches on the outside of the UW housing whie underwater, therefore termed 'wet lens) theres a serious dark corners on the image and thus defeats the purpose of a Wide angle lens.
I was hoping the new G10 with its wider lens (28mm vs the G9's 35?mm) the lens barrel wouldn't extend as far and therefore suitable for WA wet lens.
There are few guys in taiwan (www.fun-in.com.tw) who manufactured their own lens adapter for G7/9, so actually the biggest problem is not the strange lens port (shape like a cube instead of rounded) wouldn't take
wet lens, but the lens length.
Another problem with the canon housing is the lack of a bulkhead to attach a sync cord so as to enabe ttl strobe function. Since I'm already using Sea & Sea's YS110 I need this bulkhead to use ttl. but if you haven't got any UW external strobe yet,you can use inon's strobes which use the G serie's internal strobe to trigger ttl in the inon strobe.
there are other housing out there which limits the extention the lens barrel by a shorter lens port. since G10 is a reatively new model not a whole lot of guys making housing for it. Ikelite usually are quite quick on their toes with new models but what I don't like about ike is the fact you need to use their own strobe to achieve sync cord ttl. I just heard that fisheye just anounce a G10 housing(http://www.fisheye-jp.com/cg10/index.html [in japanese]). Its great aluminium housing but like thier other products are quite expensive, and also don't know yet about their peripherals/lens situation. If past aftermarket G9 housing is any guide, I am assuming the lens wil need to be attached on land/dry, just like a DSLR.
I heard also patima might come up with a G10 housing pretty soon but we'll just have to wait and see.
what strobe to use? depending on what you are shooting at. at macro i use 1 Sea & sea YS110a, and for wide angle 2 ys110a. these use sync cord ofcourse and if you want optical fiber cable to be trigger by internal strobe; the inon Z240.
How's the visibility in the river? as a rule if you want to take WA shots you'd want a very
long arm to be placed behind and besides the lens to avoide back scatter. With any non DSLR camera you gonna have shutter lag for sure, also DCs on macro shots you'd have to get very close to the subject, and if your subject is skittish which i'm assuming the frog will be, you're not gonna get the shot. in this case its best with DSLR. I really like seatool's housing which allows the DSLR pop up internal strobe to work. I heard this is already enough for macro shots using a 60mm macro lens (or the 50mm macro zuiko for oly). this makes it really compact and I like that. but again very expensive for this housing. however you still need UW external strobe for WA shots as to avoid back scatter (the internal popup strobe is in the middle which reflects any particle in the water right back into your lens) and you need the extra power external strobe provides.
Hey guys if you have other opinion or suggestions please do write up I'd be happy to hear what you have to say...
hi frikosal,
sounds like a good choice to me, i was very happy with my G7. i just upgraded to a dSLR (olympus E520) and, as expected, it is in a different class. the shooting speed (shutter, focusing, shot-to-shot flash recycle etc) are sooo much better in the dSLRs.
but on the other hand the dSLR is much bigger and more expensive than my car.
for the work you mention i think the canon G10 would be excellent. it is very fast for a compact and its macro is very very good.
also even with the canon housing (that's the one i have) you can get an M67 adapter that goes on the lens barrel and allows you to screw on extra external (wet) lenses for macro.
i am using an Inon UCL-165 macro lens which gives you roughly a x2 magnification and i am very happy with it. you can stack those lenses too, you can use two of them for more macro/magnification.
i use the inon strobes (Z240 and D2000) with simple optic cables and i am very happy. i use the same strobes with my dSLR now and i am even more happy!
if i were trying to decide for a new compact camera for the work you mention i would go for the G10 with an inon z240 or (if you dont mind a slower recycle time) the D2000S
I recently purchased the G10 and am trying to decide which housing to buy. The Ikelite is clearly better than the Canon housing, but I'm not sure if it is worth the extra $400. Any thoughts or suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks,
Greg
hi greg,
i was using the canon housing with my G7, and i was very happy with it. i used it for two years and about 200 dives. i only had a minor issue with it: after 100 dives/1 year i found that sometimes at depth (25-30m) some buttons would get stuck (pressed). that would make the camera unresponsive. when the shutter release button would get stuck, i had to turn off the camera and wait for a minute or two: the button was not really stuck, it would come up again but very very slowly !
my guess is that this was a problem with the button o-rings getting a bit stiff especially if the camera was unused for sometime (2-3 weeks of no diving). after i noticed this, i would press the buttons in and out a lot before putting the camera in the housing and that seemed to work fine. i also tried some silicon spray on the button o-rings (fronm the outside of the housing of course) which also seemed to be ok.
this problem happened only 4-5 times out of 200 dives and even then it was not a big issue (i could use my ... knife to pull up the buttons!).
other than that the housing worked fine. i traveled with it quite a bit, the housing did many dives off small boats where cameras have to tough it out a bit, many many shore dives with rough exits on rocks with waves rolling you around a bit, with the camera banging on rocks and all that. the housing was great on all those occasions. it is still fine and in use.
the ikelite housing is much bigger, heavier and all that. but having a lever for the shutter release button is really good.
if i were buying a G10 now i would buy the canon housing again, not the ikelite. mainly because of the huge size and weight but also the price. i've used the ikelite housing for G7 only once or twice, so maybe i havent had enough time to appreciate it !
the price for the ikelite is a bit high i think. ikelite has cheaper housings for many compacts, but the canon G series still have the expensive housings. i think ikelite should make a cheaper "compact" housing for G10.
there was a nice sea&sea housing (for G9 at least) too: in case the ikelite is not expensive enough !
I am also looking at the G10 and WPDC28. The one thing i was concerned about was TTL capability.
I have heard there is a fibre optic kit that apparently sticks onto the outside of the housing and filter the internal flash so only the infra-red light is send to the strobe to control it.
Unfortunaly i cannot find anywhere to confirm this is correct.
Has anyone heard of this device as i am looking at a strobe that can be fibre optic controlled and at a great price,but it would be usless if it didnt work with this system.
Hope someone can help
cheers MARKWA
hi MARKWA,
not sure about the infrared filtering you mention, but i've used the usual fiber optic cables with external strobes to get TTL or TTL-like kind of exposure.
i am using two INON strobes (Z240 and D2000S) with optic fiber wires. i've used them with the G7 in a canon housing and with my olympus dSLR.
with the canon G7 everything worked great. the "external TTL", or whatever they call it, works very well. i ve put lots of duct tape to block the internal strobe and also to fix the fiber optic cable to trigger the external one.
all the photos on my flickr pages taken with flash (canon G7 and olympus E520) use fiber optic cables to one or two inon strobes (absolutely no manual adjustment on the strobe output- everything is done by the camera/TTL)
the olympus does a much better job with exposure i believe but that should be expected from a dSLR i guess.
i dont have a pic of my rig, but here is one i found through google:
http://www.scubaboard.com/gallery/data/3058/IMG_2145.JPG
Hi all,
My gf bought the G10 along with the DC28 Canon housing a month ago and we've used it recently in our Bali trip.
Not much complain EXCEPT that there's no way for us to change the shutter speed or the aperture in Manual, AV or TV mode while using the u/w case. This is because changing those setting requires the use of the dial at the back of the camera (where the macro button, flash button etc are located). The case does not have a control dial or any means of moving the dial.
It was a little bit frustrating, but we got over it by pre-setting the shutter to 1/250 in TV and then f2.8 in AV.
Would appreciate it if anyone could tell us if there're any ways for us to change the aperture or shutter value while using the case. Can anybody help us?
Cheers,
Bart
Hi Taso,
I have been visitng your very informative blog for quite some time now. Nice!
Just wondering - Do you happen to know how can I change my apperture and shutter speed with the Canon housing for G10? The problem is that those functions are controlled by a dial, which the housing does not provide any control over. It's very frustrating when I'm shooting in full Manual mode underwater..... Thanks in advance
dear Bart and Awesome Blossome,
i imagine this function works the same way as with the G7 that i had:
you can control the dial through the housing (for example to set aperture or speed etc) by a combination of two buttons:
there is a user-selected-function button in the back of the camera, in the upper left corner (marked with an "S" and something that looks like a printer). you can assign this button any function you want, as a shortcut. OR you can use it to control the dial through the housing (in which case you should NOT assign any function to it).
keep the function button pressed and then use the right or left button in order to get the same function as the clockwise and counterclockwise turn of the dial.
note that in order for this to work, you need to leave the function button unassigned. it should do nothing when you press it. you can do that (remove assigned functions) through the setup menus (sorry i dont have the camera with me to see what the menus are called).
perhaps you could confirm that this work on the G10 as well?
thanks!
Yes, your suggestion works on my G10! Thanks a million! Now I can forget about ditching the Canon housing for an Ike. Thanks again!
Hi Taso,
Thanks a lot for your input. Apparently, the same function works with the g10 as well (confirmed by awesome blossome).
What a relief....now we can concentrate on just getting lighting setup and forget about changing housing.
Cheers.
Bart
Hi all,
I am considering G10 + WP-DC 28 and would really appreciate if someone could tell me whether the M67 adapter would fit the housing.
I've previously used the M67 adapter to attach Inon UCL165 macro lens to the WP-DC21 housing (for G9) and intend to use the same adapter/macro lens with the G10 housing.
Thanks!
Samuel
hi samuel,
good question-
i see an M67 adapter for G10 listed here for example http://uwdigitalcamera.com/goods_detail.php?goodsIdx=284
a different M67 adapter is listed for WP-DC11/21 (and does not mention the DC28...)
http://uwdigitalcamera.com/goods_detail.php?goodsIdx=264
by the way, the owner of uwdigitalcamera.com (Yuzo) is very helpful and amazingly fast with email questions..
Thanks Taso! Confirmed.
I also have just found from http://www.oceanicfocus.com/catalog/index.php?cPath=27_45
that I would need a special adapter.
Samuel
Hi Taso & Samuel,
I saw in a shop here in Malaysia that 10Bar has an M67 adapter for g10. Cost about US$30.
By the way, anybody has been using Sea & Sea YS110 alpha? I heard there's a problem with the battery compartment that it always leak and that you'll be driven up the wall trying to get Sea & Sea customer service to entertain you. Is this true?
Thanks
Bart Huzaimi
Hi,
I have been using the g10 extensively for the past few months and really love it! Am hoping to purchase the water housing (Canon's) but have had bad luck with housings leaking in the past...would be interested to hear if anyone has had any experience with leakage using the g10 housing?? and if insurance/warranty covers the camera if some leakage does occur..
any tips or feedback much appreciated!
Rupert
Thanks Bart. I think I've come across the Malaysian store's web site.
I have never had a problem with YS110 (not the alpha series though). I suppose the alpha should be better than its predecessors.
And Rupert, I have two Canon housings and have experienced only 1 leakage after around 100 dives.
The incident happened with Ixus 75 housing (WP-DC14) that was about 1 year old. I think I did not put any silicon grease before the dive neither do the annual O-Ring replacement as suggested by the manufacturer. So, it's probably my mistake.
Otherwise, I believe Canon offers the most affordable and functional housings.
hi rupert
i have used my canon WP-DC11 housing (for the G7) for 150 or so dives and never had any problems with leaks. the dives i did include overseas travel, diving from small boats (where cameras bounce a bit), shore dives with somewhat rough exits/entries, a bit of being rolled over the rocks by bigger waves, you know the usual stuff..
i never changed the o-ring but i was careful with preparations/silicon grease and all that.
talking about flooding cameras, i did "flood" my older pentax camera (in a pentax housing) but it was my mistake too: i put the camera in a tub to soak it with fresh water after the dive, but by accident i filled the tub with hot water... i am guessing that the batteries sort of exploded in the housing. the housing didnt leak actually at all: when i pushed the button to open it, the housing bursted open as it had some extra pressure in it. the camera was flooded with battery fluids only.
can anybody that has a G10+WP-DC28 housing confirm if the exposure compensation dial (+/- 2 stops, top left of camera) is able to be manipulated through the housing? i find precious little information about the WP-DC28 housing online (only frontal pix) and my main motivation for considering the G10 as a new UW camera is that dial. if the housing does not allow for it to be used then i don't want to take the plunge (ooh! a pun!).
thanks in advance
Monkeyboy,
There is indeed a dial to adjust the exposure compensation on the WP-DC28.
-Ann
already ordered a wpdc28 housing. problem is we usually dive deep. down current is very common in my area. would the camera implode if pass the limit by 20 - 60 feet?
hi,
ive recently purchased the standard canon uw housing but am frustrated by the seeming lack of control dial for shutter speed/aperture..is there any way round this other than to just have it on auto shutter/aperture??
any help much obliged:)
rupert
hi rupert,
yes you can control the dial through the canon housing using a combination of two buttons:
(copying from my earlier comment further up in this thread)
"...
there is a user-selected-function button in the back of the camera, in the upper left corner (marked with an "S" and something that looks like a printer). you can assign this button any function you want, as a shortcut. *OR* you can use it to control the dial through the housing (in which case you should NOT assign any function to it).
keep the function button pressed and then use the "right" or "left" button in order to get the same function as the clockwise and counterclockwise turn of the dial.
note that in order for this to work, you need to leave the function button unassigned. it should do nothing when you press it on its own. you can do that (remove assigned functions) through the setup menus (sorry i dont have the camera with me to see what the menus are called).
..."
I have just changed my system to the G10 and Canon WP-DC28 housing. Has anyone found a way to adapt filters to this housing. I have previously used an Ikelite filter, but the unusual shape of the DC28 port raises questions.I would prefer not to have to bond a filter on the inside of the housing port.
Thanks,
Steve
hi steve,
there are some M67 adapters for the WP-DC28, like this one from uwdigitalcamera.com,
which is i guess is similar to this one from reefphoto. and here is another one from divervision.com
i used a similar adapter (the one from uwdigitalcamera.com) for the WP-DC11 housing which had the same odd lens barrel shape. i used it with a red filter and with the inon UCL-165M67 macro wet lens. it worked fine with both. the red filter slightly blocked the corners (very little though). the macro lens blocked the view a bit, but i would zoom in a bit and it was not a problem for me. you can see how much the red filter is blocking the lens in this photo for example. The lower two corners are slightly (barely) blocked. probably you could fix that by adjusting the adapter more carefully (push it upwards...). Note that this is the filter slightly blocking the lens, not the adapter. if there is no filter, then the view was not blocked at all.
the adapter i used, fits around the front of the lens barrel and is held on by two small screws (the screws go into the groove where the diffuser fits).
and i could not use the diffuser with the M67 adapter on, if i remember correctly.
Hi Taso,
Your blog is very informative. Thank you.
I have been diving with the G10 in the Canon housing and an Inon S2000 (which I must add is a terrific strobe) since January.
I have 40+ dives on the package without any drama. Deepest was only 128 feet, mostly in the 80-90 foot range. Never a weep or any issues with controls.
Where I do have an issue is that I feel that the camera focus is very slow to lock up, particularly if using any zoom. Of course, I'd like to more closer to the subject, but in cases where a small creature is nestled deep in a coral, some zoom has to do.
I have been using the underwater setting as I am not even a 'serious amateur'. Do you have any suggestions as to what I might be able to do to improve the performance of the focus? Has anyone else noticed this happening to them?
Thanks,
Xavier
hi Xavier,
focus light and spot focus help a bit.
are you using a focus light?
i think it makes a big difference, especially in cases where you have high contrast or for example a small critter under a rock, where your subject is in low light while around it there is more light.
also i found it makes a difference to use spot focus instead of the default focus settings.
i havent had issues with slow focus, but i do remember sometimes the camera (G7) wouldnt focus correctly; but that was usually an issue with my focus light.
if you are not using focus lights underwater i would think it will make a difference.
i've used the fantasea 44led and the fantasea nano focus light and i was very happy with both of them.
very recently i got the fix led1000dx focus light (that's a $600 light) and i am looking forward to diving with it...
I've been thinking about upgrading (or "sidegrading") from my Sea&Sea to improve on the high ISO performance. The plan is a G10 with a single 110Alpha strobe, but the wide angle is issue...
Now, I've seen M67 adapters for the WP-DC28 housing but ideally I'd like to get bayonet wet-lenses so that I can change during the dive (like my present Sea&Sea).
I know Inon have them for the Ikelite housing and but I find that a bit bulky and they seem to exist for the G9-housing (DC27). Have you seen or heard anything about Inon AD adapters for the 28-housing?
So far my searches drew a blank on this.
Many Thanks
Matt
Another thought (that I have so far been unable to find an answer to):
Do you know if the Inon 67mm lenses are interchangeable underwater?
If so I could at least get the performance I want even though threading is not as fast as bayonet.
Thanks again
Matt
Hi Matt, Yes the 67mm wet mount lenses are interchangable under water. Fantasea has a brand new adapter for the G10 - not yet available but B&H Photo is taking orders now. Per Fantasea should be out in a couple weeks.
I have been using an SD790IS and WP-DC24 for about a year, with good results. I am considering moving up to a Canon G10, and have two questions to add to the discussion:
1. The Canon housing is rated to 130 feet, whereas the Ikelite is rated to 200 feet. I dive the Blue Hole regularly, and have been to 156 and 161 feet. Does that tip the balance in favor of the Ikelite, for $400 more?
2. Can anyone compare the Powershot 790 with the G10? What improvements can I expect? Greater depth of field?
Thanks,
Denny Crane
I have recently upgraded to a G10 and WP-DC28 housing. Does anyone use an after market monitor hood? If so, what kind and any comments would be of help.
What are people's thoughts on using an M67 adapter on the G10's UW housing in relation to using the camera's built in flash? Does anyone know of an adapter that doesn't block the internal flash?
I've read that many have issues with this and you must use an external strobe.
I'm hoping to mount a Cokin filter system to the adapter and use the internal flash for some shallow work.
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